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RE: stumbled on this site

Do_Go_Be_Man — Wed, 25 Jun 2008 12:08:58 GMT

G,

[quote]Why wasn't that approved?[/quote]
Thanks for reminding me of the context of your experience with Christian Science.

In the context of your other messages and in the absence of objections that would have indicated a problem, [u]it appeared to me[/u] that it was merely sarcastic argument for the sake of disagreement.

Do Go Be Man
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RE: stumbled on this site

Do_Go_Be_Man — Wed, 25 Jun 2008 10:28:04 GMT

G,

[quote]I'm telling you, it's not that scary over here on the "Godless" side. The world is more beautiful when you accept that it's a mystery.[/quote]
The world is beautiful and mysterious. While we may not agree on how or who created it, it came to exist somehow. While I still have a lot to understand, God provides the best explanation my little brain can comprehend. Much easier than trying to understand such beauty and order coming from empty chaos.

[quote]Wait, if the Bible is false about Hell, it's still true about Hell? That's pretty circular. What if it's wrong about Hell and there is no Hell?[/quote]
Not circular at all. What I said was, "Hell is eternal separation from God, so even if the Bible is false then Hell is true." If the Bible is false then you're probably right about Creation being Godless. Thus, whether the Bible is true or false, we are apart from God unless He does something about our separation.

[quote]Also, are you saying I'm living in Hell right now? If so, that's exactly what I'm talking about. I know you don't condemn me to Hell, but you know I'm going to Hell or live a life of Hell. I don't.[/quote]
In the context of my comment, if you are apart from God then you are in Hell. Words can be used in many ways. I suppose that the more specific and theologically accurate connotation of "Hell" would be about eternal life after living life on Earth. Describing yourself as Godless, I presume that you don't believe in eternal life so therefore see no need to be concerned about it. That is your decision and your right.

From my perspective, when you find yourself face-to-face with God, you're going to experience quite a shock and likely entirely rethink your theology. I'll probably also experience a level of shock and rethink some of my theology. The shock is the difference between theory and experience. The character of the shock is the differences in theology.

Regarding your unapproved later post...
[quote]Ah, sorry. I don't mean to debate Christianity, that isn't the purpose of your site. I'll stop.[/quote]
Could you please remind me about your connection to Christian Science? While mutually respectful discussion of Christianity is a privilege, you're right that the purpose of this site does have the commonality of our mutual experience with Christian Science.

Do Go Be Man
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RE: stumbled on this site

Do_Go_Be_Man — Tue, 24 Jun 2008 14:21:16 GMT

G,

[quote]... what about mainstream Christians and their belief in Hell? ...[/quote]
The problem with the question starts with the fact that the Bible provides our most credible descriptions of Hell. Accepting Biblical teachings as lies leads to some pretty scary conclusions such as eternal separation from God. Hell is eternal separation from God, so even if the Bible is false then Hell is true.

No Christian has ever condemned anyone to Hell. We couldn't do that if we wanted to. That's just something that comes along with being human. We are natural born sinners incapable of being suitable company for God on our own. As such, we start off condemned, dead in our sins, and unable to do anything about it on our own.

Thank God, He is just and merciful!

Do Go Be Man
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RE: stumbled on this site

Linda — Tue, 24 Jun 2008 12:29:36 GMT

[quote]I would say some of the earlier mentioned negative experiences with Christians I've had stem from their belief that I was going to Hell. If they try to be nice and loving about it there's still an amount of pity and condescension over something that, to me, is imaginary.[/quote]

I can't speak to how specific Christians treated you since I didn't see it. But I do suspect that their attitude toward you was different from what I'm talking about with Christian Scientists. Christian Scientists negate a person's present reality and emotional needs by essentially saying (thinking, acting as if, etc.) "the problem you think you are having is not real. It is no part of you. Don't feel the way you are feeling. If you would just correct your thinking, you wouldn't be seeming to suffer." CSists misunderstand, or refuse to even acknowledge, much of what makes a person who they are on a daily basis. That's different from the salvation issue; Christians don't deny the reality of a person's human experience, regardless of whether they think that person is going to heaven or hell.

RE: stumbled on this site

Gentle Dove — Tue, 24 Jun 2008 08:39:10 GMT

Linda is right. That behavior is classic Christian Scientists. From what I was taught, you are not to get into their "dream" and to do so is called sympathetic malpractice. I would surmise that not too many families outside of Christian Science are afraid of sympathetic malpractice and getting into someone else's dream.

RE: stumbled on this site

Linda — Tue, 24 Jun 2008 07:14:57 GMT

[quote]It sounds like a family problem, not a CS problem. I've met CSers like that, but I think there were other things going on there.[/quote]

The problem with Christian Science is that, even when people ARE kind and caring, they often can't be kind and caring on what I call a "gut level." They may care about you, but when you are sick they instinctively put up emotional walls as they "know" your perfection. They can't validate your emotional needs because they can't acknowledge that your problem is real. And you can't really pour your heart out to them (as sick people sometimes need to do becaue they need for someone to understand what they are going through) because you know that the Christian Scientist either doesn't want to hear it or will instinctively block out (or simply minimize) what you are saying. The emotional walls built in Christian Science are subtle but powerful, even when those walls are built between nice people who really think they're caring about each other.

RE: stumbled on this site

Linda — Thu, 19 Jun 2008 06:59:55 GMT

[quote]While MBE borrowed from a lot of Eastern religions, the Bible retold a lot of ancient myths.[/quote]

Or perhaps the ancient myths are built around real history. For example, there are stories about a huge flood in many ancient cultures, and I have heard someone comment that the Bible just has its own version of the ancient flood story. But it makes more sense to me that, if ancient peoples all over the world had stories about a big flood, perhaps there really was a big flood! :)

RE: stumbled on this site

Linda — Thu, 19 Jun 2008 06:40:59 GMT

Anonymous poster #14789,

Thanks for sharing. I understand the torment you have gone through as you lived in, then then broke free from Christian Science (see my story, "From Christian Science to Freedom," in the [url=http://www.christianway.org/Personal%20Stories/personal_stories2.htm]Personal Stories[/url] section of the Christian Way web site). And you'er right about your "giving heart" -- it's hard to give to people when they can't recognize their need!

[quote]I am a different person and a better Christian for having left CS. I have saved my children from total confusion.[/quote]

Yes! My feelings exactly.

RE: stumbled on this site

Phoenix Rising — Thu, 05 Jun 2008 16:38:44 GMT

"I can't believe there are any adults off the streets who would give CS a try unless they are related to the ostrich."

I could not have put it better.

...and Rosebud, I have felt a lot like you that why I call myself ...

Square Peg

RE: stumbled on this site

inzane99 — Tue, 27 May 2008 17:59:34 GMT

Hey Grace,

I just read your post 14401 and what MBE wrote just blew my mind. What an arrogant woman. It seems my mother developed a few of her traits. Luckily, as a teenager I wasn't too interested in reading a bunch of religious stuff(especially the CS stuff that made no sense). My parents would make me read some of her writings and I would go to my room and sort of just fake the funk.

I've always regretted my rebellious years and my drug abuse days, but now I see that at least I was able to get away from CS at a fairly young age because of these factors.

I'm ready to unite with the MBE bashers just as I would unite with the Satan bashers.

One poster said you can't blame CS for a lot of things...maybe thats true ...but I can blame it for my mothers insensitivity and coldness. CS is at the root. It has to be, because if you don't have Christ at the center of your life...what do you have?

I can remember having to read the lesson and my parents saying "Did you mark your lesson for next week....I couldn't stand those metal markers...anyone else out there with a distaste for those metal markers. By reading the Bible like they do I never got a true picture of what it was all about until I left. Years later I tried to talked to my parents about some relevant Bible stories and they had no clue what I was talking about. My parents were also "class taught" whatever that is and they were trying to get me to do the same. All I know if what they had was divine Love I wanted no part of it. Even today my children don't gravitate towards their grandparents and I've asked them why and they have told me its because they are afraid of them. Even children can detect coldness and now I know its not me. The guilt trip is over. CS people need to take responsibility for their actions.

Hey, I didn't sign up for this, I was born into it. What's your excuse?

Inzane99;)

RE: stumbled on this site

Do_Go_Be_Man — Mon, 26 May 2008 13:30:42 GMT

Rosebud3,

No problems, but thank you.

Do Go Be Man
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RE: stumbled on this site

Rosebud3 — Mon, 26 May 2008 11:33:18 GMT

Do Go Be Man,

I apologize for making assumptions of my e-mail being dropped. After going through the threads I found the original post I responded to. I guess I got confused because inzane99 posted on my grief posting as well, so it looked like mine was dropped. It's good to know that we're all human and make mistakes and God still loves us. If anything, I've renewed that understanding this AM because one of my core issues has been feeling that I am left out or separated somehow. Sincerely Rosebud3

RE: stumbled on this site

Rosebud3 — Sun, 25 May 2008 11:35:02 GMT

Dear Inzane99,

Hi, glad you made a post. My excuse for being involved and still reading CS material etc. is that a portion of my family was CS. It did affect me profoundly. What's interesting in my case is I was raised Presbyterian and I became a medical nurse. Therefore I have experience in both approaches or standpoints, as one might put it. So, I think I bring a unique perspective on all of this. You can read about me under Intoductions: new member coming to terms with grief.

Considering I have a psychiatric nursing background and many years in neuroscience, and family experiences, I think I can understand how CS can be used as a comfort, like a blanket. Call it denial if you will, but a lot of us are in denial constantly. I know I am often in denial of God's existence when I don't understand something, but I pray and trust because I know that I have felt loved in the most complete sense by God.

Is it possible that anything understood in an incomplete manner could result in failures? This is certainly true in medicine. I wonder if it is true in Christian Science. That does not make it someone's fault for not understanding it, anymore than my Doctor would blame me for not understanding a chronic disabling condition I have, that at this point medical science has many, many questions to ask and many of us are offering ourselves up as "lab-rats" because we are in so much pain. And by the way I 've had the condition for over 30 years and had to reclaim my life constantly, even under medcal care.

I do like so much that you stressed it is God who does the healing or miracle and that we need to give credit to, and be grateful to God for that. I read that you were looking forward to seeing what posts there might be soon , so here is one.

RE: stumbled on this site

inzane99 — Sun, 25 May 2008 04:50:05 GMT

I'm new to this forum...just last night...and couldn't wait to read some more this morning. I've just read all the posts on this thread and agree 100% it's not "trashing" it's "stating the facts".

I grew up in a CS home and it wasn't easy. Most of it has faded from memory but hearing some of the old sayings bring back memories....like "sheperd show me how to go" that was mentioned. I had to laugh on that one. I can't imagine what it would be like to be an adult in CS and have to reckon with the real Truth....that Jesus died on the cross for sins that we couldn't pay. Luckily, I was rebellious in my early years and recoginized "there was no life, truth or intelligence in CS" . See, the early effects of my brainwashing from my parents are still intact. Nah, not really...just recalling some of the axioms.

What gets me now is their healing methods and how they take credit for their own healings instead of giving glory to God- the true Physician. My wife experienced a miracle a few years back which I will tell another time and it came about through His mercy. If you read the New Testament of all of the healings and miracles Jesus performed you will see that the participants all humbled themselves before Him and asked for His mercy or believed Jesus could heal them(faith). Not one took credit for their own healing or by denying something was wrong in the first place. Honestly as I'm writing this I can't believe MBE used the Bible in the first place as her theories don't even remotely agree with the written Word.

If I had to describe CS in one word it would be ....denial with a small d...MBE liked to capitalize words too much so I say small d is appropriate. I can't believe there are any adults off the streets who would give CS a try unless they are related to the ostrich.

Hey, I was born into CS ...I had no choice....what's your excuse?

Inzane99 ;)

RE: stumbled on this site

IleftCSin74 — Mon, 14 Apr 2008 23:43:30 GMT

I would be willing to mail you one of my copies of the book, but I'm keeping my 1996 First edition copy, which I consider somewhat more accurate. I never knew why the Church wanted to supress the references to them until recently reading from these various ex-CS sites.

Mark

RE: stumbled on this site

IleftCSin74 — Mon, 14 Apr 2008 22:04:34 GMT

The full title of the book is: Healing, Wilt thou Be Made Whole? A Spiritual Answer, by Jamae W. Van Eck. There is an original 1st edition copy signed by the Author on Alibris for $200.00. Amazon.ca (Canada) has 2 copies of the 1997 edition for $3.45 CNDN Funds. There are other copies on other booksellers. Look up her name on a list of CS Teachers in CA. A 1996 First Edition is the one that the Church and a few other people made threats over. Anything published after 1996 is not an original First Edition.

I would want her not to find out that I have contacted you. I'm sure that there would be fireworks. My stepdad died less than a year ago. (Bart Van Eck). Someday I hope to be able to write a book, but it probably will have to wait until after her passing.

Between my first and second trips to Hazelden several copies of her book found there way into their library. My counselor there told me that different patients had brought copies and my mother had mailed at least one copy. My counselor was Jim Atkins, and Hazelden is 800-257-7800, though you would need a release to talk to anyone there. I was there first in August of 1996, and again in October of 1997.

Mark

RE: stumbled on this site

Gentle Dove — Mon, 14 Apr 2008 19:09:54 GMT

Welcome IleftCS! I look forward to reading more of your posts. I hope you find this site as helpful as I have. I am so sorry that you have suffered so and I think it is important to let your story be known. The victims of Christian Science must NOT stay silent.

RE: stumbled on this site

Do_Go_Be_Man — Mon, 14 Apr 2008 13:16:45 GMT

Mark,

Not being familiar with it, I tried to find information on your mom's book. Can you provide a link?

Again, I need to walk the line between welcoming you, appreciating your contributions, and noting that you are sharing points of view that may not represent those of the forum host, moderators, or other participants.

Do Go Be Man
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RE: stumbled on this site

IleftCSin74 — Mon, 14 Apr 2008 13:01:13 GMT

In response to Gentle Dove: I wholeheartedly agree with you. Even my mother, one of the leading "Scientists" of the modern era, laments her inability to heal her own children. I was accused of not having enough faith to "heal" athlete's foot at age 7. This despite the fact that caught early enough this disease was easily treatable over-the-counter. My mother forced the local ER to rebreak and reset my broken leg (at my age 12) without anesthesia, because it was "against or religion". She was a fledgling Practioner at the time. I was forced to "walk-off" three ankle sprains, and was forced to suffer with broken bones on several occasions without any comfort but prayer. To this day my mother claims that the "healing" of my broken leg was s miracle, despite the intervention of the medical community and 6 weeks in a cast.

I've also noted in my mom's book, "Healing, a Spiritual Answer", that she stetches the truth on a couple of her cases of alleged "healing". I remember "Diane's" story much, much differently. I was there when it happened, at age 15, and I can tell you that there was far worse then the "momentary discomfort" my mother writes about. Diane left Vail to seek more competant MEDICAL treatment from a specialist, instead of the "miraculous healing" ascribed to by my mother, and was in a cast for quite a while. She also includes various people without their permission, including me and my sisters, and was forced by senior church staff in Boston to amend several statements that she made about the CS Church in her book's first printing. Basically senior Church officials were unhappy that mother had linked tenants of CS healing in her practice to the teachings of senior church leaders. I can't understand why that made them unhappy. They are probably worried about the legal ramifications. My dad threatened a lawsuit to get his name and actions removed from her book.

Talk to "all in one" about my story: I mistakenly sent it to them labeled as a private message believing that the entire group would have access to it. As a novice user I have no idea how to move it into the public viewing arena. Does anyone know how to relabel a private message public?

Mark (new)

RE: stumbled on this site

Grace — Sat, 05 Apr 2008 17:50:57 GMT

Hi Everyone,

It's been a while since my last post -- so long I can't remember when, actually, but I've been reading and as always continue to be grateful for all of those who contribute. The original poster of this thread made reference to a certain post (they included the exact location on the site, which was very helpful) and I just read it.

I love the way this site helps me deal with difficult emotions. Just reading it sometimes I can so relate and feel such sympathy and compassion for others who have left CS and had to deal with the ensuing struggle to re-adapt to life. I imagine, after reading that particular post, that perhaps the writer has been dealing with such a struggle. In any event, I found this paragraph which really stood out to me. Wow!

[i]If one were to commit to following another persons' interpretation of the Bible, it would be advisable to find out as much about this person as possible - their credentials, where they studied theology, etc. - along with a close scrutiny of their life, to see how these things stack up under the microscope. Jesus said, "you will know a person by their fruit. A good tree cannot produce bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot produce good fruit". On close examination of Mrs. Eddy's "tree", we find that she had the arrogance to find fault with Jesus: "Had the Master utterly conquered the belief of life in matter, He would not have felt their infirmities" (Science and Health - 1875 - pg.130). "Had wisdom characterized all His sayings, He would not have prophesied His own death and thereby hastened it or caused it" (miscellaneous writings - 1897 - pp 83&84). "The idea given of God this time is higher, clearer, and more permanent than the one given eighteen centuries ago (letter from Mrs.Eddy to student). With this last statement, Mrs.Eddy exalts herself above Jesus. The Christian Science Journal added to this by saying, "a woman perceived the nothingness of matter, though Jesus did not, and she was able to interpret the feminine idea of God, which is essentially higher than the masculine, because it was the last and therefore God's best idea. That's nice....the last time someone wanted to exalt themselves above God...was Satan!![/i]

I am a 2nd generation ex-CSer, born and raised into the church and left about a decade or so ago, at the age of 30-something. My whole life was dedicated to CS until the time I left, and as many of you who also left CS know, that is the way it is for Christian Scientists.

My reaction to Mrs. Eddy's statements as shared above now that I have left CS and become someone who loves and honors Jesus Christ and sees him from the perspective that Christianity offers is to shudder and cringe inside. I can't help but stand in awe at how badly Mary Baker Eddy has mislead so very many people through her writings and through her "church". The physical suffering is major, yes, I don't mean to down play that at all, but the EMOTIONAL pain CS causes is incomprehensible to those who do not have first hand experience of it. What a twisted view of the Bible she presented! This site is so very important in helping the individuals deceived by CS. Christian Scientists still in the throes of its study perhaps will not see it's relevance, but that is fine. God can still use the site in their lives when the time is right. What they read here will remain with them, even if for now they don't appreciate it or like it.

My only response is "Mrs. Eddy Bashers, UNITE!" (I say that with a smile.) I don't mean it in a mean way, but rather that it is so very important to reveal the truth of what she really did say. So many Christian Scientists are not exposed to or familiar with statements like those listed in the quoted post above. They are not mentioned in CS churches, in articles, in day-to-day CS life, but are kind of kept on the shelf, covered under all the other CS jargon. And, sadly, when one is not familiar with TRUE, Bible-based Christianity, such comments don't seem to be very offensive in and of themselves, particularly when read in context with her other writings.

I'm so happy to be free from Christian Science.

Grace

RE: stumbled on this site

Do_Go_Be_Man — Fri, 04 Apr 2008 08:37:12 GMT

Gentle Dove,
[quote]Do Good (sic), you stated that " the new student is expected to "demonstrate" CS as perfectly as the multi-generational, class-taught "student" This is so true, however, it leaves the impression that the multigenerational class taught student is able to demonstrate it as well.[/quote]
I also said that [u]if[/u] the claims of CS were true and they are not. There are so many parallels to CS in history and fiction that I now have difficulty understanding how it was established and how it survives. Had I not been part of it, I would likely consider CS as just another urban legend. :)

Do Go Be Man
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RE: stumbled on this site

Gentle Dove — Fri, 04 Apr 2008 08:08:33 GMT

As for the use of the term "trashing"... let me redefine it as those in CS are so apt to do. If "trashing" is used in terms of just getting the facts of our own experiences out in the public eye and it doesn't happen to comport with what the Christian Scientists want to hear....then call it trashing. In the real world (not the "reality" of the CS'er) its called being able to call the shots as you see them, not as you want them to be. It is called, "THE FACTS". Yes, we have seen with our own eyes people die senselless deaths by relying on CS. Yes, we have actually felt the pain as children while our parents "knew the truth for us"... and many later suffered after effects of being denied medical treatment. (See the recent post regarding the article of the young woman who had to have her leg amputated when she was an adult because of an untreated infection in childhood).

,Do Good, you stated that " the new student is expected to "demonstrate" CS as perfectly as the multi-generational, class-taught "student" This is so true, however, it leaves the impression that the multigenerational class taught student is able to demonstrate it as well. It is after a lifetime of watching those multigenerationals and class taught CS fail miserably that the light bulbs begin to really go off! Those multigenerational class taught ones use the "they just don't understand" so frequently and you nod you head and go ok, well maybe...But, then when they succomb and you have to say ..THEY must not have understood either...what then? After too many of these any logical person would have to surmise that the problem is not with the person, but the entire philosophy.

RE: stumbled on this site

Do_Go_Be_Man — Thu, 03 Apr 2008 17:49:36 GMT

Anonymous 2/26/2008 7:59:31 PM,

[quote]But what drives the need to form a group with the purpose of trashing it? Accusing CS of being baseless or even evil? Why waste your time? Why the chip on the shoulder?[/quote]
To understand why we spend time "trashing" CS requires exposure to CS and an understanding of the Bible apart from it. It appears to be quite benign, attractive, and truthful. CSists, for the most part, are wonderful, gentle, loving people. On the surface, it appears to be a logical, genuine exploration of God's word for those who cannot understand it otherwise. It removes the hard parts like sin and God's judgement. Unfortunately, it also leaves out the easy parts like the personal nature of God's love and redemption (at least in a manner that is Biblically accurate).

Even if CS were all it claims (it's not), however, there remains a huge problem. The culture of CS demands that anyone practicing it do so perfectly at any level or die trying. Thus, the new student is expected to "demonstrate" CS as perfectly as the multi-generational, class-taught "student". The stigma of failing to radically rely on CS is overwhelming. The culture of CS does not even allow the level of medical interaction permitted by MBE. Practitioners rarely use the privilege of consulting with physicians even to understand the "underlying error".

MBE taught that CS never fails, only CSists. Can you imagine being served contaminated food at a restaurant, getting sick, then being taught and believing it was your fault because of the weakness of your understanding of sanitation practices? Imagine also continuing to serve that food to your children with the encouragement of your family and friends.

I am under no illusion that any CSist will ever be converted as the result of anything any of us write in these forums. Only the Holy Spirit is capable of opening hearts, minds, and souls. I can, however, pray that He will use our musings, ventings, and expostions in some manner to glorify Him. Man, I do sound like a Jesus freak. Yep, and glad of it.

Do Go Be Man
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RE: stumbled on this site

Do_Go_Be_Man — Tue, 26 Feb 2008 21:28:10 GMT

49merc,

Welcome.

One of the good things about forums such as this is that they enable the presentation of diverse ideas (in spite of what some of our critics may claim). Pretty much, the only requirements for posting here are to stay somewhat on topics relevant to our common experience with CS and conduct one's self in a civil manner in accordance with the terms of use.

Not even Linda and I always totally agree on everything we post. We welcome anyone to join the discussions to share their experiences with CS. Most current CSists have as much difficulty relating to the experiences of former CSists as we once had as CSists.

Can't say that I'm especially comfortable comparing MBE to Stalin and Hitler, that's for God to do. I am, however, comfortable comparing myself to them. One of the things I've learned from studying the Bible in its full context and authority is the reality of sin and the reality of our need for God's forgiveness. My sins are grievous and my need for God's Grace great.

I too was a third generation, class-taught CSist thoroughly dedicated to the movement, practicing radical reliance, and believing in the power of my understanding. For more than 30 years, I declared myself God's Perfect Child, "did my work", and dutifully gave thanks to CS, S&H, and MBE during Wednesday evening meetings. I was president of my CS Org, chair of various regional CS events, and looked forward to Annual Meeting and Association.

A bothersome concept got introduced during CS class instruction, we could and should study the Bible beyond the limited context of the CS Lesson-Sermon. Being the literally minded soul that I am, I began reading a lot more of the Bible and began noticing how CS skipped over certain passages. Anyway, the day came for my personal day on the road to Emmaus and I understood what God had to offer me in His word did not require new definitions and acceptance of its imperfection.

Now I totally realize that it probably sounds like I'm talking some language other than English. I certainly had great difficulty understanding the Christians who tried to witness to me as a CSist. I hope, however, that you can accept that the Holy Spirit did something good in me and that I'm not here just to trash CS. He also used CS for my good.

Do Go Be Man
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RE: stumbled on this site

zoarean — Tue, 26 Feb 2008 19:53:04 GMT

49merc,

"It saddens me that so many of you had such terrible childhoods."

You are correct in saying that many CSists are loving parents to their children. My own were kind & wonderful as they raised me, highly committed CSists as they were. But those that speak of poor CS mentors often make valid criticism, for when CS is taken to its philosophical extreme, it can cause people to be extremely cold & indifferent to those who seem constrained to "imperfection"- particularly the handicapped & the chronically sick. At any rate, I agree that some across society's spectrum take their philosophical viewpoints to extremes; some so much so that often their original goal gets lost. I think we both can agree on one common goal- to be like Christ- but we differ on who exactly Christ was & is to us today- a Person or an Idea?

"I can understand that many people do not find Christian Science their cup of tea."

I think this is somewhat of a trite way of describing the major change of heart many of us had as we left CS. We grappled at length, some of us for years, with our traditions & the view we wanted to have of God & ourselves versus the picture the Bible clearly paints of who He is & how we are to approach Him. I did not leave CS because it was not my "cup of tea"; to the contrary, CS strongly appealed to my fleshly desire to have a God who had nothing but peaches & cream for me in my life- a less holy God that could simply ignore my past & present depravity & had no need to deal with it (judge it) in concrete fashion. But I was forced to accept reality- that God does have wrath & He is to be feared; as Solomon said:

"The end of the matter; all has been heard. Fear God and keep his commandments, for this is the whole duty of man." Ecc. 12:13

May God bless you & speak to you on this forum.

zoarean

RE: stumbled on this site

Linda — Tue, 26 Feb 2008 19:46:59 GMT

Welcome to the forums, 49merc. Glad you stopped by.

Like you I was a third generation CSist, but I decided to leave the religion when I was thirty. I actually loved CS and found leaving it to be a long and painful process, but I couldn't stay after discovering disparities between the Bible and CS teachings in a number of key areas. It was only after leaving CS that I began to recognize the harm that CS teachings and practice had done to me as it taught me to minimize my own deeply human feelings and needs while trying to understand and demonstrate the "unreality" of sin, disease and death. I came from a happy family with loving parents, but this damage still occurred. I struggled for years before finally figuring out why I was suffering so much. (My story is posted in the Personal Stories section of the Christian Way web site. Click [url=http://www.christianway.org/Personal%20Stories/testimon_%20of_%20Linda_Kramer.htm]here[/url] if you'd like more details.

[quote]what drives the need to form a group with the purpose of trashing it?[/quote]

Wow -- if we wanted to "trash" CS, we would be handling things a lot differently. We actually make a big effort to keep things polite. :) Seriously...many of the people who come here have deeply troubling stories to tell. We give them a place to share their stories and receive support from people who understand what they have been through. That can be a big help to people who are trying to work through their issues.

Some of us here have recognized some troubling differences between what CS teaches and what the Bible says. We point out the differences, not to "trash" CS but to help people see differences that we consider too big to ignore. (From my perspective, Mrs. Eddy has "trashed" a lot of the Bible in her writings by misquoting and misapplying it.)

You're right that disfunction happens in lots of families and religions. After studying the issue in depth I have concluded that, even at its best, CS tends to cause emotional damage. I wouldn't have believed that until I left CS and was able to look at CS from "the outside."

I hope I've helped clarify our motives a bit. If not, feel free to ask for more clarification.