 Posted Thursday, April 13, 2006 3:35 PM
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Hi Peter,
I'm glad you are so happy and that all is well with you. I, too, send good thoughts for your interview. Sounds exciting!
Reading your post reminded of me when I was college age through to my early 30's. (but, I'm sure you've heard that before on this forum!) When reading your posts, my immediate reaction is that I have no comment in return and I know that Do_Go will generally have the most helpful response, but then for some reason, your words always come back to me the next day and I am filled with compassion and care for you. Generally, that leads me to just say a quick prayer for you and move on, but today I feel the need to do more.
I agree with John that your posts seem to leave one with the feeling that you are not quite sure of CS, even though you say that you are. I am grateful that God is beginning to work in you and that you are listening to Him and want so very much to do His will. That attitude will save you, Peter, if you keep loving God and crying out to Him. (I don't say "crying out to Him" as one who cries in self-pity, but as one who cries with a sincerity for wanting to find and demonstrate real truth).
The only words of wisdom I can offer (granted, you didn't ask me for my "wisdom", but this forum tends to lead to sharing such stuff) is one that is hard to say on-line because I fear you will take it the wrong way. That is why I haven't written it to you before now. But, I truly believe it will help you and am offering it with the sincere hope that you will hear it in the spirit it is shared. The truth is, someone once offered me the same advice many years ago and I heard it with a closed heart. Unfortunately, it took 15 years or so before those words seeped into my thought in the manner they were intended and I suffered greatly during those years because I carried resentment over it and didn't heed the suggestion. Don't make the same mistake.
When you listen to God, listen with great respect because His power is infinite. Also, listen at his feet and leave your pride behind. Drop it like a coat. Christian Science encourages self-pride. As much as Mrs. Eddy's writings declare otherwise, the spirit behind those words is full of pride. She is constantly talking about self-improvement and reading the Bible with her understanding. The way I finally saw that was to read the CS Sentinel and the Journal and then read Guideposts and The Daily Bread (both periodicals you can find online if you'd like to). Compare what you read. One is full of stories of "How I overcame this....." "How I overcame that...." and the other is full of "How God helped me through this. . . " "How God revealed that to me. . . . . " Such entirely different viewpoints and such entirely different results.
As one who has known many people who have worked at The Mother Church in the past, I believe you will get the full spectrum of what I am trying to say should you take that job. You will see the complete lack of true humility. The sad thing is, you will also see it in yourself. But take heart, most of us who have left Christian Science have all seen that same quality in ourselves and been convicted of it before God many times even after leaving the church. But we also know that God forgives us. Again and again. And this gives us heart to try even harder to leave pride behind and give our whole self as a servant of God. Peter, I know God is with you. I know He is guiding you. Keep listening. You'll do great things!
Grace
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Posted Friday, April 14, 2006 9:00 AM
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| Grace you said it so wonderfully what I've never been able to pinpoint out about my CS in-laws. The lack of giving God glory for all HE does for us. Humility is not something that comes easily, especially to Americans, but with prayers and time we can all get there. Everytime I stop in at this website and read about the struggles so many of you go through as you come out of CS I find myself saying Thank God I was NEVER a Christian Scientist and sending up another prayer to God asking for strength and wisdom to say the right words at the right time to help my dear wonderful husband find the real truth--God loves us so very much and the only thing he wants from us is to believe in him and the most wonderful gift, given today, Good Friday, his Son.
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Posted Saturday, April 15, 2006 8:42 AM
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After reading this board for many months, I find the most compelling participants to be Confused Wife and Surfer for Jesus. Right away their connection becomes obvious to many of you. They are married to Christian Scientists and if I looked back at their posts, I'm sure I'd find the most often used adjective for their respective spouses would be 'wonderful.' Marriage is difficult enough (at times) and to endure these incredible differences of human existence (and beyond) is way past the understanding for a casual reader of this site. My question to them is this: If these two CSists (SFJ's wife and CW's husband) were found to be participating on another website contrary to evangelical thinking and posting words such as, "I love my wife/husband but she/he believes Jesus to be God and that heaven and hell are actual places, so I must show patience until they come to the realization and the truth of Mrs. Eddy's writings," how would you react? If I remember correctly, these two people are not 'new' to Christian Science and CW and SFJ were well aware of the pitfalls. Remember the word 'wonderful' means 'full of wonder,' and is a strong magnet for those in need.
Curious
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Posted Saturday, April 15, 2006 8:36 PM
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Curious, I'm guessing you have some kind of CS background, is that correct. Knowing the perspective from which you come could help me in answering this question, but I will still try my best. I knew little to nothing about CS when I married my husband. In our first probably 5 years of marriage the only time he attended church was when we either visited his parents or his parents visited us. After attending the CS service a couple of times a year for those 5 years it became clear I did not understand the teachings at all. I attempted to read and understand S & H but to no avail. I'm a college educated so I don't think I am stupid. I have since found the conflicts between what I have read inn S & H and the bible to be too much and sought to understand from those that have left CS how it happened for them. That is how I came to find this great website.
As for your question as to how I would feel if my husband were on a website, etc. I would be surprised because he knows how devoted I am in my faith and how much I read the bible. We have had discussions about religion and he has never asked me to read S & H and was actually surprised when I told him that I have read some of his CS literature but that it doesn't usually make sense to me. He is not what I would consider a practicing CS. I think his hold on the faith is more one of obligation to his parents than true belief. He may disagree with that. At least he has never given me any indication that he would like me to learn more about it. As far as I know he has never joined the church as a member as an adult.
So does that answer your question curious? Wonderful also means admirable and excellent. When I say my husband is wonderful it is because I admire him as a person and is an excellent husband and father. And you are right, marriage is challenging at times but we have a respect for one another and that is a solid foundation in our relationship. Having respect for someone does not by any means that you can't continure to wish more for them. I would very much like to share a spiritual connection with my husband that I have seen in non-mixed (religiously mixed) marriages. To be able to share a faith in God is something very special as I am sure many others on this board can attest.
I am curious as to why you say the word wonderful is a "strong magnet for those in need"?
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Posted Saturday, June 24, 2006 11:00 AM
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I THANK GOD, I AM A CHRISTIAN SCIENTIST ALSO. STUDYING CHRISTIAN SCIENCE HAS HELPED AND BLESSED ME IMMEASURABLY. Back in 1986, I had been studying The Twelve Steps and was on the third which says: "Made a decision to turn my will and my life over to the CARE of God as I understood God". Well I certainly had not understood God, much less believed in God.
I was born into Catholicism and was quit confused about it all so I went on a search for a God I could understand. Well it brought me through many religions and churches and from each one, I recieved new insight but the most profound effect occurred when I saw the sign above the Desk at a Christian Science Church which read "GOD IS LOVE" and realized that was how I could understand God. Well I knew I had found what I needed and so began my study of the weekly Christian Science BIBLE Lesson. Oh how I gleamed such comfort, and hope. It fed me spiritually and I began to understand my relationship with God through Christ Jesus. I found a friend and guide for this journey on earth where I could continually turn (resort) for wisdom, comfort, UNDERSTANDING, and healing words and my only requirement was to study, pray and rely on God, good. It is such a relief to know my relationship with God is everpresent, inseperable, and eternal. Oh how I drank in the Truth of Being.
I do not worship Mary Baker Eddy but I do respect, appreciate, and am grateful for her loving contribution to humanity of the everpresent availability of the Healing Efficacy of CHRIST JESUS. Her strength, perseverance, toil, study, and prayer of Scripture gave to the world a glimpse of what happens when we reach to touch but the hem of Truth's garment.
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Posted Monday, June 26, 2006 5:38 AM
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Dear Musey,
Welcome to this forum, I am glad you found it.
When reading many posts you'll find many ex Christian Scientists who were raised in this religion but also people - like me - who at some point in their lives found Christian Science and were immensely grateful for it, loved it and would have defended it against anything. My studies at some point led me to contradictory messages from S&H and the bible, and to the decision which one I was to believe. I chose the bible, and I am glad about it. May God guide you as you read the posts and bless you!
Marion
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Posted Sunday, July 30, 2006 5:34 PM
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Hello Thank God, thanks for your posting. Fellow CSist here who enjoyed reading it.
CHRIS
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Posted Tuesday, August 08, 2006 7:28 AM
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Jan,
"You are a good reason why I hate religion (man's or woman's doctrines) and without doubt it hates me."
I hate religion too! I'm totally against organized religion! Jesus was anti-religious. Mary Baker Eddy was anti-religious. I was because of the religion that we got the Council of Nicaea!
I consider myself more spiritual than religious.
John,
"Peter: It's interesting that you would compare the science of calculas to Christian Science. The two are not in the same league."
Hence the metaphor.
"Calculas is an exact, hard and empirical science, and if you do the caluculations in a correct way, they always come out right. This is true in all cases."
Yes, but only when you thoroughly understand it that the answers always come out right.
"CS, on the other hand, is not a proven science, let alone a hard or empirical science at all"
yet. Science is catching up quickly, though.
"In short, there would be no need for them to breath, drink water, eat, cut hair, sleep, go to the toilet , brush teeth, etc. etc. etc., (and of course, be sick or injured ever, because such thngs don't exist.)"
Can't wait for that day!
"The truth is, if you are honest enough to admit it to yourself, you spend 99% of your life succumbing to mortal illusion just by going through your daily routines. In doing the things that I just mentioned, are you proving daily that man is exclusively spiritual? No, you are proving that he is just the opposite-both material and spiritual."
There IS no spoon, man! Christian Science doesn't bend the spoon, that's impossible! It's about bending yourself! Your mind, your way of thinking, your perception of reality. And when you realize that you will know and understand that man does not live by bread alone.
Matt. 6
O ye of little faith?
31 Therefore take no thought, saying, What shall we eat? or, What shall we drink? or, Wherewithal shall we be clothed?
32 (For after all these things do the Gentiles seek for your heavenly Father knoweth that ye have need of all these things.
33 But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.
34 Take therefore no thought for the morrow: for the morrow shall take thought for the things of itself. Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof.
"No, you are proving that he is just the opposite-both material and spiritual."
Matt. 6: 24
No man can serve two masters.
Gal. 5: 17
For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.
Romans 8
6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
You cannot be both. It's either one or the other. True or false. Life or death. Good and evil. Spiritual or material. Spirit or flesh. Truth or error. I know which one I am, do you?
"I was never a math whiz. Just the opposite. Still, math students I knew, along with math teachers, engineers, etc. had no problem with Calculas. Using your analogy with CS, how do you explain the heartbreaking stories from folks on the website of relatives, etc. who have the equivalent of a PHD in CS (as practioners, life long students, etc.) who are suffering terribly because even with all of their knowledge and devotion, they can't seem to apply "the truth" in a critical point of their lives. Along with them, their relatives and friends suffer also."
The realization of Truth can be as easy as realizing 2+2=4. It's about understanding that was the core of my analogy, not comparing Christian Science to Calculus. Understanding.
In the words of Jesus: "Hear, and understand"
"Finally, nobody is CS has ever escaped the final "mortal illusion", and that's death (least of all MBE). IF CS were true, surely one of the hundreds of thousands of CSists would have done that by now, don't you think?"
That you know of... You should look up my username's namesake Calvin Frye, you might find it interesting or at least a good read.
Now, I'm currently 21 and I do plan on living well into three digits (maybe 4?), but I do anticipate an eventual boredom and by that time moving on (or in this case, passing on) to a highly plan of existence would be appropriate. Does that mean I will die and on longer live? Of course not! Life is eternal. My True Spiritual Being will continue eons after my false material body will kick the bucket. The illusion of death is to consider it the final act, the end, good-bye, so long, farewell, etc., but in reality life continues. Never-ending.
And Jesus proved it too!
See the Passion of the Christ if you don't believe me 
"Peter, you are young (and boy did I hate it when somebody said that to me in my late teens and 20's)."
It doesn't bother me. I am young. Young in heart. Young in spirit. The only way to go in life, in my opinion.
"Don't dismiss the idea that Christianity may have another way."
Ummmm, no. I like the way I'm doing it already. Me leaving Christian Science because of a terrible tragedy or personal crisis (like what some of you have experienced and made you leave Christian Science thinking it failed you) is like Jesus giving up during the scourging. True, there have been some moments of doubt and depression, but never once have I or will ever consider leaving Christian Science. Those moments of doubts and depressions are more akin to please "let this cup pass from me" or "why hast thou forsaken me?" but you know what happens shortly thereafter.
"I personally believe that God has led you here off and on to encourage you to think and explore some new options."
No, going here actually helps me reaffirm my beliefs.
Do Go Be Man,
"Actually, not quite sure we're in the same book, but I think you know that by now"
No, like I've said before: We're all looking at the same picture, just at different angles.
"I consider CS as a copy of a copy of a copy heavily influenced and edited by erroneous wishful thinking."
And what do you think has happened to "mainstream" Christianity? It's been perfectly preserved undistorted and error-free for the passed 2000 years?
Gnosticism is only considered "unchristian" and apocryphal because the Council of Nicaea decided it was (see above).
When I first learned of Gnosticism, my thought immediately went to the Church Manual where it says to "reinstate primitive Christianity and it's lost element of healing."
There were so many similarities that Gnosticism to it's core was Christian Science 2000 years ago.
Gospel of Mary:
The Saviour said There is no sin
They got it!
And because of "mainstream" Christianity, it was lost for centuries, until the Comforter came.
"Boston can certainly be an exciting and eye-opening place."
I should know. I've been living around here for the last 20 years.
"I pray God's blessings on your job interview and whatever employment He provides for you."
Thank you and I did get the job and I love working at the Center!
Grace,
"I agree with John that your posts seem to leave one with the feeling that you are not quite sure of CS, even though you say that you are."
Oh no. I can assure you that I was quite sure of Christian Science. Going back to my analogy, I have no doubt that the principles of Calculus are true, but the ability of me applying those principles I still have to work on. Same with me and Christian Science.
"When you listen to God, listen with great respect because His power is infinite. Also, listen at his feet and leave your pride behind. Drop it like a coat. Christian Science encourages self-pride. As much as Mrs. Eddy's writings declare otherwise, the spirit behind those words is full of pride. She is constantly talking about self-improvement and reading the Bible with her understanding. The way I finally saw that was to read the CS Sentinel and the Journal and then read Guideposts and The Daily Bread (both periodicals you can find online if you'd like to). Compare what you read. One is full of stories of "How I overcame this....." "How I overcame that...." and the other is full of "How God helped me through this. . . " "How God revealed that to me. . . . . " Such entirely different viewpoints and such entirely different results."
If you actually read through the end of the stories in the Sentinel and the Journal, you would know that they're more full of "How I overcame this through God....." "How I overcame that through Science...." and all those stories are about being grateful to God and Thanking Him and Loving Him constantly. The stories aren't "How I did this" or "How I did that" "because of me because I so super awesome". No! It's because of God and their understanding of Christian Science! Our lives are not our own!
God is my Life. If that's not humility, then tell me what is.
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Posted Tuesday, August 08, 2006 7:28 PM
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